Nelson & His World

A friend of mine is convinced a hotel close to his home was stopped at by Nelson during his final journey between Merton and Portsmouth. He proceeded to show me the few bits of evidence he had collected to support his claim.
The hotel in question is 'The Burford Bridge' located at Box Hill, Surrey. The building does have a genuine Nelson connection, he and his party briefly stayed there during a holiday in the summer of 1801. I do though, remain sceptical of the claim concerning Nelson's final journey!
http://www.infobritain.co.uk/Accommodation_Burford_Bridge_Hotel.htm

As far as I'm aware the old London - Portsmouth road is very much on the same line of the present A3? I recall that when 'Paradise Merton' was purchased its ease of access for the road was commented upon. Studying a map, Box Hill would have been an unnecessary detour?

I have now found another publication that refers to the stop at Burford Bridge.

In response, all the material I have, thus far, found on the journey would have followed any stop made at Burford Bridge (Box Hill).

Does anyone know of a reliable account of the initial stages of the journey between Merton and Guildford, and the route it took?

Trimmer,

Like you, I too am scepticle of this claim – without firm and documented evidence! It would also be interesting to know what 'bits of evidence' your friend has. I don't know the area, but having also looked at a map, I too would have thought that it was a little off Nelson's route.

I can't find any references, so far, to the actual places that Nelson stopped at to change horses and perhaps have a bite to eat (that probably being all that it was, he being in a hurry). Most authorities seem merely to say that he left Merton following dinner on the evening of 13th September, and arrived at the George in Portsmouth at approximately 6am the following morning. As you can see he wasted little time, and I can't see him deviating off the London-Portsmouth road to visit an out of the way inn. I would also have imagined that there were several inns and stopping places on the actual road itself, so he wouldn't have needed to do so.

I sounds to me like another case of wishful thinking - and the magic name of Nelson! Having seen the list of other famous people that apparently stayed at the hotel, I wonder what hard evidence they have for the others?

Looking at 'The Story of Nelson's Portsmouth' by Jane Smith..who quotes E.Hallam Moorhouse in his book on Nelson in England, she mentions one stopover at The Royal Anchor at Liphook..just to change horses and that the journey from Merton to Portsmouth took seven and half hours.

The evidence relies almost solely on local myth, and a few snippets, from sources that could be recognised as having a commercial interest. One that I did find quite interesting came from a book published in 2005 called ‘The Nelson Way’. Page 154:


The book has a preface written by Anna Tribe, and its historical content was checked by Peter Green of the Nelson Society. Recognising the depth of knowledge in the production of historical aspect of the book left me wondering whether there is a reliable record of a stop at Burford Bridge? Or has local myth given Nelson’s earlier visit in 1801 a sensational tweak?

I have just read the relevant passage from ‘Nelson In England’ E. Hallam Moorhouse :

No mention of Burford Bridge, the explanation of the route also suggests a direct line from Merton. Does it though form a definite contradiction of the claims?
It would be interesting to know how many stops would normally be taken between London and Portsmouth. The layout of roads in 1805 and the how much of a time delay would be incurred by travelling via Box Hill.
Richard.

Richard,

I would suggest that this does not auger well for having the claim substantiated! As to the 'Nelson Way', and its apparent vindication by two such Nelsonian authorities, perhaps they thought it best to let sleeping dogs lie – probably realising how hard it is to change such myths. I also think that his earlier visit(s) may have been given a tweak here.

E. Hallam Moorhouse, in her book, would seem to have Nelson arrive in Portsmouth earlier than he did, since Nelson himself says that he arrived there at six, on the morning of the 14th. Her other assertion, that he left his sextant behind at the Anchor, also had me wondering. Is this just another myth? More importantly, do they still have the sextant? If he had had it with him, he may perhaps have taken it with him into the inn since it would have been valuable, but my understanding was that all the belongings he was to take with him were packed and sent on to Portsmouth previously. Would his sextant not also be included?

I don't really know how many stops would have been normal, but this journey was surely not normal, even though I would have thought his Lordship would have stopped at least twice.

Kester,
An interesting paragraph taken from a report on the delivery of the Trafalgar dispatch allowed a little mathmatical experiment:

The news was brought by post-chaise from Falmouth, Cornwall to London by Lieutenant Lapenotiere along what is now the A30. The journey, which covered 271 miles was completed in 37 hours at an average speed of 7.25 miles per hour with 22 changes of horses along the route. In Surrey there were horse changes in Bagshot and Staines.

Working on the same figures, the 68 miles between Merton and Portsmouth works out just about spot on. A detour to Burford Bridge would have put 22 miles on the journey. The postchaise would have needed to of averaged well in excess of 10mph to accomplish the journey. I think it unrealistic to believe that it could possibly have been done!

The sextant is interesting might be worth following up?

Richard.

Richard,

You would seem to have got there before me, as I had also thought of comparing Nelson's last journey with that of Lapenotiere's after Trafalgar – which would seem the obvious comparison, short of anything else.

It might also be worth considering the average distance between stops, which perhaps give some indication as to how far a team of horses could comfortably travel before they needed to be changed. I would imagine there were rules and conditions laid down for this. A look at the Ordnance Survey Trafalgar Way Map, shows the places where Lapenotiere changed horses and these would seem to be roughly about ten or twelve miles apart on average, give or take. Some stretches between changes are considerably longer (particularly over the moors and other sparse areas), and others shorter.

Conveniently, the map also shows Nelson's last journey from Merton to Portsmouth. However, and using the same criteria, I find it hard to believe that Nelson stopped only the once, at the Anchor in Liphook, although this appears to be the only one mentioned, as far as I am aware, in hard fact – but obviously not in myth! It is of course accepted that Lapenotiere was travelling as fast as possible, and covered the distance in a shorter time than the average mail coach (thus more stops were probably needed) but presumably Nelson was also travelling relatively fast.

However I still think as do you, that a stop at Burford Bridge was unlikely and incomprehensible, as it is well off the London-Portsmouth road and, as you have worked out, would have put 22 miles on the journey. 10 mph would seem rather fast for a sustained speed, but between 8 and 9 seems more reasonable. If Nelson left soon after dinner as is stated, say at 10pm, I make it that he would have averaged 8.5 mph on the road to get to Portsmouth by 6 am the following morning. If he left an hour earlier at 9 pm, he would have averaged around 7.5 mph, close to your figure for Lapenotiere. The latter figure would seem the more likely, allowing for changes of horses, etc.

It had crossed my mind that a stop at Burford Bridge might only have been possible, if Nelson had not begun his journey on the Portsmouth road, but instead taken other local roads to Burford, before joining the main route afterwards. However, these roads would presumably have been smaller and bad, and with the added risk of getting stuck. They may well have also been the haunt of highwaymen. I think we can dismiss this possibility, as I can't imagine his Lordship would have taken that risk – and he would have wanted to get to Portsmouth as quickly as possible.

Regarding the 'sextant', it is more likely to have been a quadrant, which I believe was the more common instrument at that time. However, to the uninitiated they are all sextants, which is the instrument used today. I also asked myself, 'how many does Nelson possess?' Since he was an Admiral, he would have hardly needed one in any case, since his sun-sighting days were probably over, and he relied on other junior officers for that information! I have a picture in a book of Nelson's quadrant, which is credited as being in the RNM at Portsmouth – although of course I can't say where it was before that!

Kester,
According to an entry in Nelson's private diary, dated 13th September he left at 22.30:
'At half-past ten drove from dear dear Merton...'

Just as a matter of interest I read the passage from 'Nelson In England, E.Hallam Moorhouse' concerning Nelson's stay at Burford Bridge Hotel during summer 1801. A description of Nelson's room ends:
'a low, rather dark little room, by reason of the trees outside, looking away from the gardens and towards the highway.'
Without having a map of the area dated 1805, Its hard to know the exact route of the highway mentioned. Whether it run directly from Merton, or where and if it picked up the Portsmouth road?

I believe there must have been at least one change of horses before Liphook on the night in question, but remain very doubtful that would have been at Burford Bridge. The timing of the journey convinces me the journey was made directly along the main London - Portsmouth road, which, Nelson's carriage picked up close to his home 'Paradise Merton'.

Richard.

This may help - or at least prompt more discussion.

I took a look in the database of 19th century newspapers - you never know what snippets are to be found in there!

Anyway I found a reference to Nelson being at Burford Bridge on the night he left for Portsmouth BUT it comes from a stage play. In 1896/7 the actor/manager Johnston Forbes-Robertson produced a play called The Fair Enchantress obviously focussing on the life of Emma Hamilton.

I will attach below a clipping from one of the articles about the play which I hope is self-explanatory. I have highlighted 3 pieces - but it is obviously the last sentence which is key here.

Now you could take one viewpoint and say - well there is the proof!

But for this notion to be first aired 90 years after the event suggests to me the exact opposite. i.e. my guess is that F-R has been somewhat loose with the facts which have then been interpreted as the truth!

I would love to see the script of The Fair Enchantress play to see how the story develops and how come Nelson and Emma are both at Burford Bridge.

Anyone care to comment?

Richard,

Now how could I have missed that rather obvious piece of evidence – and which of course, I have read many times! That would then seem to put his average speed at around 9 mph.

I agree with the rest of what you say, and this speed would certainly imply that there must have been at least one change of horses, before Liphook. This even more indicates that the journey did not deviate from the London - Portsmouth road, and I think we can discount the, somewhat fanciful, scenario I suggested. You mentioned Nelson's own carriage, which is perhaps one difference between his own mode of conveyance and that of Lapenotiere, who of course used a public vehicle - if only for his own use! One might think that Nelson's coachman therefore might have known the smaller roads, rather than just the main one, particularly as we are led to believe that his Lordship had been to Burford Bridge before, but again the time scale and other considerations strengthen the view that Nelson remained on the London - Portsmouth road for the whole journey.

Mark,

Thanks for that information. You say that this was 'first aired 90 years after the event'. Is this a fact? It would be interesting to know the 'facts' on which Forbes Robertson based his play, or was it just hearsay and myth, which seems the more likely.

I think we are all now inclined to the 'fact' that this is just a story, myth, fable, whatever you like to call it.

Hi Kester

Sorry it was a bit late in the day when I made that post and it wasn't very well constructed.

What I was trying to say is that I hadn't found any earlier mention in the newspaper database and as yet we don't seem to have found any earlier mention anywhere else.

And this first mention seems to appear out of the blue in a work which is quite likely part fact/part fiction.

I definitely would like to know how Forbes-Robertson managed to place Nelson and Emma at Burford Bridge for their last farewell.

I imagine there will be a copy of the script out there somewhere - maybe in a theatrical archive or somesuch.

MB

P.S. Trimmer, it would be useful if you can tell us what the "bits of evidence" are that your friend has collected.

Well! - it shows how easy it is to get hold of the wrong end of the stick.

I assumed (I know, I know!) that Forbes-Robertson was the author of this play. Not so - the author was one "Risden Home".

And having read the title of the play in one of the articles I assumed that to be true. Again not so - it was not The Fair Enchantress BUT Nelson's Enchantress.

All that is confirmed by the cover of the programme (see below)!

You only have to Google the title to see that the launch of the play received a great deal of publicity. But from what I can make out it was not particularly well received and closed within a few weeks.

Anyway I don't want to take this thread off on a tangent - but suffice to say this play, or the newspaper article about it MAY have been the first inference that Nelson was at Burford Bridge on that last journey to Portsmouth.

MB

It has been most interesting to read whether Nelson did or did not stop off at Burford Bridge. I do not want to go off the thread, but I just Googled 'Risden Home' and found two references to the playwright of Nelson's Enchantress. See the last paragraph of the link, when it is revealed that Risden Home was a pseudonym of Mrs de Lacy Lacy. She was the daughter or step-daughter of an Admiral who 'must have served under Nelson's companions-in-arms'. I wonder who that could be?

http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bi ... 70513.2.52

Apologies Kester, my wording appears to have mislead you:

I very much doubt it was Nelson's carriage, as far as i'm aware a postchaise was normally a hired vehicle, pulled by hired horses?

Earlier I fed both routes into a modern route planner, of course without comparing past and present road layouts it is open to debate. These were the results:

Paradise Merton - Portsmouth 67.7 miles, average = 9 mph.

Paradise Merton - Burford Bridge 15.2 miles.
Burford Bridge - Portsmouth 64 miles
Total miles 79.2 miles, average = 10.56 mph.

Lookiing at the second route it seems likely (as Kester has already pointed out) that inferior roads and a possible extra change of horses, would deem seven and a half hours to complete the journey over optimistic!

Mark, many thanks for the interesting information! My opinion on the Emma at Burford Bridge topic, can again be attributed to the sensational aspect that surrounds the whole Nelson commercial bandwagon. Continuing a little further into his entry 13th September 1805, he wrote:

Surely a reference to Emma and Horatia ?

My friend lives local to the Burford Bridge Hotel. He has pretty much taken the hotels claim at face value, backed up only with tourist leaflets and repeated local myth. I have always argued that with no factual evidence, it seemed unlikely to me that the route would have entailed a stop at Burford Bridge. Frustratingly! I have never been able to find historical fact to 100% disprove the claim. I was hoping a published account of the entire journey existed, finally resolving the matter!

Richard.

Apologies if this is a little convoluted - fuzziness descends when numbers appear! A bit dweebish too – I’m currently looking at coach routes out of Manchester around this time, and the subject is simply fascinating.

The London to Portsmouth Road. (Travel by public stage-coach circa 1805 – 9 hours.)

Here’s a link for the London to Portsmouth coach route of 1765: http://tinyurl.com/7ndc9ms

If you read from the left (from bottom to top) you can follow the established route from Southwark to Portsmouth. (The route was virtually the same in 1803.)

If I remember right, travellers from London to Merton were told, “The best way you can come is over Clapham Common.” I imagine Nelson coming from Merton would join the Portsmouth road from the Clapham junction (6 mile point on the map) before passing through Wandsworth and onwards. That’s a journey of around 5 ½ miles from Merton before joining the Portsmouth Road.

Liphook (spelt Lippock) appears at the top of the second column at the 47 mile point and (for future reference) Guilford/Guildford is at the 30 mile point.

'The Nelson Way' states that Nelson travelled from Haslemere to Liphook. It’s interesting to see that Haslemere isn’t on the Portsmouth Road – although the Haslemere road links up to it at the 45 mile point, just before Liphook. I can’t see any reason given for why 'The Nelson Way' refers to Haslemere or Box Hill on the route.

But… I don’t think it would have been difficult for Nelson to reach Burford Bridge because the Brighton Road virtually began at Merton Bridge (it was the second stop), crossing the Wandle and travelling through Epsom and Leatherhead to reach Burford Bridge (an established stop on the route) and Dorking before crossing the Portsmouth Road at Guildford. The Brighton Road would have been a quality thoroughfare - certainly on a par with the Portsmouth equivalent.

Using the mileage from the coaching maps/routes of the time, if Nelson travelled entirely on the Portsmouth Road, his journey would have covered 73 miles (including the connection from Merton.)

Using the same published timetables for the Brighton Road, Merton to Burford Bridge = 14 ½ miles. To Guildford (a major turnpike and stop) = 14 miles, and onto Portsmouth = 43 miles. A total of 71 ½ miles (1 ½ miles less than if Nelson had stuck to the Portsmouth Road.)

Perhaps a combination of the Brighton and Portsmouth roads were the best option for a traveller starting out from Merton rather than Southwark or Wandsworth? For Nelson, on a practical (and emotional) level, the route might have made sense.

I’m sure these calculations are far from perfect, but is there any evidence to show that Nelson definitively set out on – and stuck to - the Portsmouth Road?